Gen 4 Zunes (No BS I swear)

[Morpheus Phreak]

Your partial apology accepted.  I could have swore you were staff since your thing says Ruler, and you are a different color on the listings.

Anyways...That 1.93bn revenue, combined with the additional funds made in 2008 put them fully into the black as of 2008.

Ok MP I guess I am a little more dense than Radiation. Revenue is not only profit. Are you saying that all the losses for all the quarters in which the xbox had a loss is less than the profit for all the quarters in which the xbox had a profit? The use of the division does obscure what the actual individual components contributed.

By the way the fact that you claim to work for MS (and I grant you probably do) does nothing IMHO to give added validity to your arguement. I am totally uninterested in the xbox as a device, my only interest is has it made money for MS or not.

To put it simply the entire division is now 'in the black'.

The only way for that to happen is for a profit to have been made.

There has been about a year now where E&D hasn't been 'in the red'.

[ethics001]

^^^^

Two problems:

The financial position of the division is not the financial position of the device
"In the black" needs to specify a time frame. It does not mean since the inception of the division.

[Morpheus Phreak]

The division was not 'in the red' until the launch of the original XBox.

The division is now 'in the black'.


I'm not understanding what is hard to understand here.



Also I'm guessing you didn't take many economics classes to understand how things are counted.

The division is what the losses were always counted in. They never counted the losses as device losses, but division losses. The division now turns a profit based on the strength of the device and attachment sales.

[ethics001]

If a division has 10 straight quarters during which it has losses of 1 million dollars each quarter followed by an eleventh quarter in which it has a profit of 1 thousand dollars the division is in the black for that quarter.

Also if a division has 11 components ten of which have a profit of 1 million dollars and 1 of which has a loss of 9 milion dollars the division has a 1 million dollar profit. But the 1 million dollar profit tells me Jack Stuff about the health of that 1 high loss component Why do I care? As a stockholder I would want to have management make a damn good case for continuing to throw money at that component or otherwise ditch the component

Like you: "I'm not understanding what is hard to understand here.".

Also Bad guess.

So in hopes of not wasting any more time: I give up. You win

[Morpheus Phreak]

Right, and what I'm telling you is that AS A WHOLE the division is in the black. I'm not talking about a single portion, or a single quarter, but that they have made more than they have expended in the E&D division, altogether, not for a set period of time.

[Socal]

Right, and what I'm telling you is that AS A WHOLE the division is in the black. I'm not talking about a single portion, or a single quarter, but that they have made more than they have expended in the E&D division, altogether, not for a set period of time.

We get that - it's not a hard concept to understand. Right now, on a quarterly basis, the division as a whole is generating a profit.

What you seem to miss is the larger point, that, over its lifetime the XBox product line has lost far more money than it has earned. As an investment, from a pure P&L standpoint, it has not performed well.

Not hard to understand - don't know why you continue to struggle with such a simple thing 

[Morpheus Phreak]

Right, and what I'm telling you is that AS A WHOLE the division is in the black. I'm not talking about a single portion, or a single quarter, but that they have made more than they have expended in the E&D division, altogether, not for a set period of time.

We get that - it's not a hard concept to understand. Right now, on a quarterly basis, the division as a whole is generating a profit.

What you seem to miss is the larger point, that, over its lifetime the XBox product line has lost far more money than it has earned. As an investment, from a pure P&L standpoint, it has not performed well.

Not hard to understand - don't know why you continue to struggle with such a simple thing 

Read what I said again...."not for a set period of time."

The division is no longer in the red at all.

*sighs* I seriously don't know why I'm bothering at this point.

I mean seriously...this is grade school level reading comprehension being shown here, or intentional ignorance.

Which is it?

[Socal]

Right, and what I'm telling you is that AS A WHOLE the division is in the black. I'm not talking about a single portion, or a single quarter, but that they have made more than they have expended in the E&D division, altogether, not for a set period of time.

We get that - it's not a hard concept to understand. Right now, on a quarterly basis, the division as a whole is generating a profit.

What you seem to miss is the larger point, that, over its lifetime the XBox product line has lost far more money than it has earned. As an investment, from a pure P&L standpoint, it has not performed well.

Not hard to understand - don't know why you continue to struggle with such a simple thing 

Read what I said again...."not for a set period of time."

The division is no longer in the red at all.

*sighs* I seriously don't know why I'm bothering at this point.

I mean seriously...this is grade school level reading comprehension being shown here, or intentional ignorance.

Which is it?

Grade school reading comprehension - on your part. This division, as we all know, lost billions for years (probably somewhere between 4 and 8 billion from what I've read). A billion and a half on the red ring of death alone. So when you look at them over their lifetime (i.e. no set time period like "last quarter") they still have a lot of digging to do.

 

[Morpheus Phreak]

Grade school reading comprehension - on your part. This division, as we all know, lost billions for years (probably somewhere between 4 and 8 billion from what I've read). A billion and a half on the red ring of death alone. So when you look at them over their lifetime (i.e. no set time period like "last quarter") they still have a lot of digging to do.

 

I've been able to read since the age of 2. I tested at college level for reading comprehension by the 3rd grade, and was able to perform college level math before I entered the 5th grade.

I've WORKED at Microsoft, and know what I'm talking about especially since I WORKED in E&D.

What's your excuse?

[Socal]

Grade school reading comprehension - on your part. This division, as we all know, lost billions for years (probably somewhere between 4 and 8 billion from what I've read). A billion and a half on the red ring of death alone. So when you look at them over their lifetime (i.e. no set time period like "last quarter") they still have a lot of digging to do.

 

I've been able to read since the age of 2. I tested at college level for reading comprehension by the 3rd grade, and was able to perform college level math before I entered the 5th grade.

I've WORKED at Microsoft, and know what I'm talking about especially since I WORKED in E&D.

What's your excuse?

Your bona fides seem impressive, however your writing strains their credibility. As for working there, that means little unless you're not being completely truthful and your position was much higher than you indicate.

[ethics001]

Grade school reading comprehension - on your part. This division, as we all know, lost billions for years (probably somewhere between 4 and 8 billion from what I've read). A billion and a half on the red ring of death alone. So when you look at them over their lifetime (i.e. no set time period like "last quarter") they still have a lot of digging to do.

 

I've been able to read since the age of 2. I tested at college level for reading comprehension by the 3rd grade, and was able to perform college level math before I entered the 5th grade.

I've WORKED at Microsoft, and know what I'm talking about especially since I WORKED in E&D.

What's your excuse?

I always discount the postings of those who brag about their intelligence or education prefering to allow the posts to speak for themselves. So far that seems to be an excellent strategy for this thread.

[Morpheus Phreak]

Your bona fides seem impressive, however your writing strains their credibility. As for working there, that means little unless you're not being completely truthful and your position was much higher than you indicate.

How does my writing strain the credibility of the facts about myself, or what I have said in this thread?

I use proper grammar, syntax, and contextual basis. My spelling, minus occasional slips of the fingers on the keyboard, is beyond reproach.

I think the real issue here is that you do not wish to deal in reality, and want to pretend that you are without fault.

Sorry, but all of us have a fault of some sort. Mine however, is not in my level of honesty, or knowledge about a company for whom I have worked.


If you think only executives have knowledge of the financial status of the divisions they work for, you are showing another glaring omission in your knowledge.


Once again, are you claiming more knowlege than someone who has worked for a company?

[Morpheus Phreak]

I always discount the postings of those who brag about their intelligence or education prefering to allow the posts to speak for themselves. So far that seems to be an excellent strategy for this thread.

Yes, and I always discount the postings of someone who chooses a name for themselves with no sense of the meaning of said name.

It would amply benefit you to learn what ethics are.

[FrnchDp]

man.. this thread needs a little TLC and some RESPECT



There.. that's better already!! 

[Socal]

Your bona fides seem impressive, however your writing strains their credibility. As for working there, that means little unless you're not being completely truthful and your position was much higher than you indicate.

How does my writing strain the credibility of the facts about myself, or what I have said in this thread?

I use proper grammar, syntax, and contextual basis. My spelling, minus occasional slips of the fingers on the keyboard, is beyond reproach.

I think the real issue here is that you do not wish to deal in reality, and want to pretend that you are without fault.

Sorry, but all of us have a fault of some sort. Mine however, is not in my level of honesty, or knowledge about a company for whom I have worked.


If you think only executives have knowledge of the financial status of the divisions they work for, you are showing another glaring omission in your knowledge.


Once again, are you claiming more knowlege than someone who has worked for a company?

Yes, your use of the paragraph as an organizational unit is beyond reproach... 

[Morpheus Phreak]

Yes, your use of the paragraph as an organizational unit is beyond reproach... 

It's called outlining.

If you had paid attention in grade school you might have learned about the process of outlining major points, as opposed to the paragraph structure.

Paragraphs are meant to be used for narrative purposes, ie. letters and books.  Outlining is meant to be broken up into small chunks to emphasize details or points.


I do note, however, that you can no longer debate on the original point.

Why not just go hang out on the Apple forums. You obviously wish to revel in a self-congratulatory circle-jerk, and I hear that is quite the order of the day over there.

[Morpheus Phreak]

man.. this thread needs a little TLC and some RESPECT

There.. that's better already!! 

If either of the simpletons above were capable of it, then I would be willing. Neither of them seem to be capable of logical thought.

You really should confine Socal to the Mac sections as you joked earlier.

At least there his posting would be appreciated and not seem to be a joke.

[Socal]

Yes, your use of the paragraph as an organizational unit is beyond reproach... 

It's called outlining.

Oh, sorry. See I said paragraph skills to give you the benefit of the doubt, because as an outline that was truly atrocious. You try and be nice...